First we went around cause, purpose, domestic solutions etc… now we are going around neutrality. As far as I understand about neutrality, it is about being
neutral among the concern parties. Here the concern party is member. Members of NIXI (ISPs and registrars) do not find anything that happened in the past 6-7 years as against neutrality.
If required, we can get a neutrality confirmation statement from the existing members to vouch that there is no form of bias that was demonstrated by any
of the board of directors or of the team members that manage the operations of NIXI. If there were any such complaints or issues of members in the past to substantiate that there was no neutrality in the operations of NIXI, please highlight those. I’m honestly lost now on the route that this discussion is taking.
Regards Desi Valli From: apnic-talk-bounces at lists dot apnic dot net
[mailto:apnic-talk-bounces at lists dot apnic dot net] On Behalf Of Vebtel - Kusumba S Check my comments below: Thank You for acknowledging that NIR in India shall be formed. Kusumba S >>> Please correct... there is no acknowledgment and at the same time there is no objection! No objection cannot be attributed to acknowledgment. As I clarified in my last mail, unless the documents and neutrality is established,
it is difficult to get convinced. When I say neutrality, it is "by members", "for member" and "to members" from top of the organization to the ground. Without which, it is never neutral but a compromise for no reason.
The detailed response of Desi and others are not helping you as your objective is outsourcing of APNIC. This outsourcing, I agree is not being talked by community and that’s why
you are finding the discussion void. Kusumba S >>> NIR did not raise outsourcing issue. As again, you may have missed, I have mentioned this in detail about two years back!
Please help the community with your inputs on what was your plan and objectives for NIR, as your statements suggest that you only know and others do not know.Please shower your
blessings on the lesser mortals like us too! Kusumba S >>> Ofcourse, would have been the first to do it when I find neutrality. As a matter of fact, may be you are not aware of history when the first NIR thought-process-documentation was made. The basic application itself is not complying
the above three requirements "by members", "for member" and "to members", so it does not qualify my view.
On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 5:39 PM, Vebtel - Kusumba S <kusumba at vebtel dot com> wrote: While I appreciate your reasoning, the concerns will not be addressed till such time the documents are published and made public.
All your earlier mails have been responded by Desi/ Mutthuswamy / Brajesh and others in details. Looks to me that you have missed out. However please feel free to point out if
any concern has not been responded. NIR is not the solution of all woes but NIR is an opportunity for addressing few of them! Whenever anyone would do things on their own, the learning’s, importance, implementation are entirely different. Mutthuswamy has also tried to explain the same in his mail. Similarly
Desi’s response on routers from Japan. You need to have your objectives clear. Is it your concern on APNIC revenue or one time your interest for NIR without Govt. endorsement which was dropped by APNIC community. If it is APNIC's revenue, then it is not only because of India NIR , it is also due to the other 6 NIRs. In Andy’s words “This is no reason to reject NIR for India ”. If it is
due to drop of your proposal due to drop of endorsement, this itself is enough for us to understand that NIR is required. Dear brother, hope your all concerns are addressed. If not, be positive to get it addressed when NIR comes to India! On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 4:51 PM, kramvir singh <krmvrsngh61 at gmail dot com> wrote: Good, you have stopped referring yourself as - "we/community". This “I” shall be addressed. The right to publishing the document is with APNIC and they have done it.Please connect
to their initial communication and you will have all the details. I am sure your so- claimed point already made, would get further clarity. On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 4:39 PM, Vebtel - Kusumba S <kusumba at vebtel dot com> wrote: I think the way I would look at this in the respect of others here, ignore this! Thats not the point to debate with you! The point is already made clear in my earlier mail and if one has
clarity on those things, publish the same and thats it! Nothing to talk!
Hey, I find the entire response deviating . In your mail I have noticed that you have referred yourself as “we” and “community” whereas in my understanding I am not able to place you in any community in India….so please
do not impose your individual views as community views! NIXI has applied for NIR so the discussion should be nation or at the most regional only. I have nowhere referred anything about language , IP, financial constraints etc…. How my understanding the same would help me in understanding which community you come from? I appreciate your view point on outsourcing from APNIC, but how it gets relevant on this APNIC talk is a surprise for me! In community instead of preaching and patronizing , please
contribute in a positive manner. In the morning I have seen mails of Andy, Gaurav, Naresh and Philip which were very positive and talking about brasstrack. Community representatives like Desi ,Mutthuswamy and Brajesh are responding well. And hope they also check on your community affiliation. In brief,which community you belong & referring is still not clear. Thanks for the only kind word in your mail – Brother! On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 3:47 PM, Vebtel - Kusumba S <kusumba at vebtel dot com> wrote: Hey,
Which country are you from , India or Pakistan? If India, please clarify which Internet community you represent as, you have mentioned in your mail you have been saying “we/community”? On Sun, Nov 22, 2009 at 10:29 PM, kramvir singh <krmvrsngh61 at gmail dot com> wrote: ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Sun, Nov 22, 2009 at 8:19 PM To:
apnic-talk at lists dot apnic dot net Dear Colleagues, _______________________________________________
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