Re: [sig-policy] prop-119: Temporary transfers, to be discussed at APNIC
>
>>
>> It is already a possibility in the RIPE region to do such transfers.
>>
>
> And?
>
>>
>> It is really to cover a corner case where organisations are not able
>> or interested in receiving the IP space in form of assignments or
>> sub-allocations, but need them to be part of their own registry for
>> full control of the space and only for a pre-set amount of time.
>
>
> Solution is simple, if the organization is not interested in receiving the
> resources as assignments and sub-allocations then just buy it.
>
> What is full control? creation of route-objects? or anything which can't be
> done by sending an email to helpdesk at apnic dot net?
>
If it is not registered to your LIR in your registry, you cannot send
an email to helpdesk at apnic dot net as it is not your space to control in
APNIC DB in the first place, but the space from your LIR that has
issued the space to you, your LIR decides how to register it and which
maintainers will be on it, you are not in full control.
And ultimately for the ones using RPKI, it needs to be under their
control to issue ROAs in MyAPNIC and not rely on any other parties for
their own IP management.
>>
>> I do not believe that spammer would benefit from this policy as they
>> would have to register with APNIC as members and provide all the
>> needed paperwork such as company registration papers, ID/passports,
>> billing address etc...
>
>
> It will definitely support the spammers by all means. You temperorary
> transfer resource to Spammer, they do their thing and get black listed
> everywhere and then you get the resources back and ask everyone that we are
> the new owner of this resource so kindly remove all the listing. REPEAT.
>
Following this logic, company name change and mergers should also be
prevented in order to prevent washing off the space in that manner.
But more specifically to the temporary transfers, not sure how that
scenario would work out in real life, transfer logs are public, it
would be visible what happened, that is no different from current
situation of issuing more specific inetnums, taking them back and
going and telling..."I didn't know what they were going to use them
for".
It really changes nothing at that level.
There would actually be more transparency to the outside world in the
process, compare to the current merger and company name changes or DB
delegation, so accountability and traceability would increase, this is
not what spammers and spammers purveyor look for.
To get a temporary transfer they also would:
A: need to be a member of APNIC
B: need to provide documentation and leave behind a paper trail.
That makes the recipient of a temporary transfer much more accountable
than one of an assignment or sub-allocation.
It also links permanently the offering party to the recipient in the
transfer log.
Assignments and sub-allocations are eventually removed from the
Database and traces of past cooperation forgotten.
>>
>> They are much better off renting a /24 from the black market with no
>> traces or documented changes ion the address block.
>
>
> Yup, let them pay black market rates for black market business model.
>
Which they will continue to do, I really cannot see how this one would
open the door to the spammers as compared to current uncontrolled and
unverified system were assignments and sub-allocations can be made
without APNIC's involvement nor receiving any form of documentation in
regards to who the recipient is.
> And what will be the temporary transfer fees? same as permanent transfer
> fees? or free?
>
To be considered as a transfer in procedure, only difference is that
they will be returned to the original LIR after an agreed upon amount
of time.
> In order to resolve a corner case it will open up opertunities for spammers.
> I stronly oppose it.
> --
> Best Wishes,
>
> Aftab A. Siddiqui
David Hilario
IP Manager
Larus Cloud Service Limited
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