Hey Elvis,
I've just watched the video of the proceedings in Xi'an, and noticed you stood up and made comments about the the issue.
Since you were there, you heard clearly that leasing is not covered by APNIC policy.... so I am not sure of your statement "as far as I know, leasing APNIC issued address space is not currently allowed by the policy. Why would your customers want to violate the policy and clearly show that in whois?" since it is clearly incorrect.
PS Adam, I know of at least a dozen of instances of IP Address leasing in our region. It is just done off-book, and involves only the lessor and lessee.
Btw... I am not saying this is good or bad... I am simply stating a situation.
...Skeeve
Skeeve Stevens - eintellego Networks Pty Ltd
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On Tue, Oct 1, 2013 at 12:08 AM, Skeeve Stevens <skeeve at eintellegonetworks dot com> wrote:
Elvis,What policy do you think this falls under?I think you will find that you are very much incorrect.Given many (most) ISPs charge for IP addresses for their customers, especially beyond the normal standard single allocation, I think you would find that this would fall under leasing.The difference from charging a client $10 per for a /29, or $500 per month for a /24 is absolutely no different to leasing someone a /24, /23..... /16 to them which they announce from their own transit or ASN (or you could lease them an ASN as well).If you can find a policy which suggest this is against policy, I would very much like to know:1) how it is different to the charging that most providers do today2) how APNIC in any way could possibly enforce such a nonsense attempt at a policy (if it exists)I've just found Adam Goslings email of August 5th 2013 to Sig Policy which includes:---Dear Colleagues,
The APNIC Secretariat notes an emerging trend toward interest in IPv4
address leasing / rental with at least one address broker offering such
a service.
This type of sub-leasing arrangement is not covered by current IPv4
addressing policy, registry services, or Member Service systems
including MyAPNIC.
....---This basically states that leasing and sub-leasing are not under APNIC policy.
...SkeeveSkeeve Stevens - eintellego Networks Pty Ltdskeeve at eintellegonetworks dot com ; www.eintellegonetworks.comPhone: 1300 239 038; Cell +61 (0)414 753 383 ; skype://skeeve
facebook.com/eintellegonetworks ; linkedin.com/in/skeeve
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The Experts Who The Experts CallJuniper - Cisco - CloudOn Mon, Sep 30, 2013 at 8:44 PM, Elvis Velea <elvis at velea dot eu> wrote:Hi Skeeve,
as far as I know, leasing APNIC issued address space is not currently allowed by the policy. Why would your customers want to violate the policy and clearly show that in whois?
PS: I'm thinking to come up with a policy proposal to permit lease of address space within APNIC. However, this policy proposal can only be discussed and (maybe) approved at the next APNIC meeting, in February.
cheers,
elvis
On 9/30/13 12:28 PM, Skeeve Stevens wrote:
Hey Byron,_______________________________________________
Thanks for the response (only 3 weeks ;-)
I have some people who are looking at leasing address space (in both
directions).
They are wondering that while they lease it, could they run their own
WHOIS server, and relay queries from the lessor of the space to the lessee.
Make sense?
...Skeeve
*Skeeve Stevens - *eintellego Networks Pty Ltd
skeeve at eintellegonetworks dot com <mailto:skeeve@eintellegonetworks.com> ;
www.eintellegonetworks.com <http://www.eintellegonetworks.com/>
Phone: 1300 239 038; Cell +61 (0)414 753 383 ; skype://skeeve
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On Mon, Sep 30, 2013 at 4:56 PM, Byron Ellacott <bje at apnic dot net
<mailto:bje at apnic dot net>> wrote:
Hi Skeeve,
Unfortunately this is not technically possible. The WHOIS protocol
doesn't have a referral or redirection mechanism; you can of course
list your own server in remarks attributes, but there's no standard
approach that lets clients follow this advice to reach another server.
If you can share the motivation or drivers for the request, perhaps
we can find another way to help solve the problem?
Byron
--
Byron Ellacott email: bje at apnic dot net
<mailto:bje at apnic dot net>
Technical Director, APNIC sip: bje at voip dot apnic dot net
<mailto:bje at voip dot apnic dot net>
http://www.apnic.net phone: +61 7 3858 3100
________________________________________________________________________
* Sent by email to save paper. Print only if necessary.
From: Skeeve Stevens <skeeve at eintellegonetworks dot com
<mailto:skeeve@eintellegonetworks.com>>
Date: Tuesday, 3 September 2013 7:54 AM
To: "apnic-talk at apnic dot net <mailto:apnic-talk at apnic dot net>"
<apnic-talk at apnic dot net <mailto:apnic-talk at apnic dot net>>
Subject: [apnic-talk] Chaining Whois Requests
Hey all,
Is there anyway, with APNIC, to setup requests to come to your
own whois server - for your ranges?
...Skeeve
*Skeeve Stevens - *eintellego Networks Pty Ltd
skeeve at eintellegonetworks dot com
<mailto:skeeve@eintellegonetworks.com> ;
www.eintellegonetworks.com <http://www.eintellegonetworks.com/>
Phone: 1300 239 038; Cell +61 (0)414 753 383 ; skype://skeeve
facebook.com/eintellegonetworks
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<http://twitter.com/networkceoau>linkedin.com/in/skeeve
<http://linkedin.com/in/skeeve>
twitter.com/networkceoau <http://twitter.com/networkceoau> ;
blog: www.network-ceo.net <http://www.network-ceo.net/>
The Experts Who The Experts Call
Juniper - Cisco - Cloud
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