Re: [sig-routing] Re: [JPNIC irr-coordinate 4] Re: About APNIC IRR

[Kuniaki Kondo <kuniaki@iij.ad.jp>]

"Philip Smith <pfs@cisco.com>" wrote$B!'(B
> At 14:43 17/07/00 +0900, Kuniaki Kondo wrote:
> >  Therefore, Users who would like to get
> >  some whois information like a AS Object, need to search three times as
> >  ARIN, APNIC and RIPE whois database.
> 
> Correct. This has always been so. Not hard, as the rule is basically you 
> start at ARIN, and if they don't have it, they point to either of the other 
> two registries. Has worked for me over the years.

  Right, to search three database is not hard, I think too.
  But, if ICANN or IRs distribute a list of AS delegation block and 
  IP address delegation block, then we get it first time and then
  we can search to apporopirate database automatically without
  to search to ARIN database.

> 
> >  So do I. I also think that we should concider the whois IRR databases as
> >  separate entities.
> >  But, the whois and IRR has similer information. Example is that
> >  AS object which is registed in APNIC whois database, is included
> >  as-in/as-out. I think that these information is for RR.
> 
> It can exist in an RR, yup. Why can't it be mandatory for allocation of an 
> AS? I think it is a good thing - the profusion of ASes and large amount of 
> multihoming is taking the Internet into uncharted waters when it comes to 
> stability.

  I agree with you.
  If so, IR may not open its feild. Because, ISPs are usually change
  connection to other netoworks. If changing connection, then its feild
  should be updated. Most of its feild have not been maintenanced, then
  these contents is always obsolete. In this situation possibly make
  some confusion, I think.

> 
> >  Actually, I think that IR is collecting and opening to the general
> >  on viewpoing of maneging of the Internet number resouces.
> >  If my understanding is correct, they would manage just administration
> >  information, I think.
> >
> >  Recently, a part of the whois and IRR information have been duplicate,
> >  like this.
> 
> Recently? as-in and as-out have always been APNIC policy. Recently to me is 
> within the last few months. TBH, I wish that ARIN and RIPE NCC had similar 
> policies, as we might have fewer vanishing ASes than we do today.

  I am sorry. You are correct.  It is not recently.

> 
> >  At first, I think that we should separete responsibility
> >  between the whois and IRR.
> 
> What is your reasoning? Remember, I come from Europe where the RIPE NCC has 
> been operating both a whois database and Routing Registry very 
> successfully. Indeed, I'd strongly argue that the regional registry is the 
> *only* place a public routing registry should be run. If that were the case 
> today throughout the world, we would not be seeing the splinters we are 
> seeing at the moment.

  Probably, I used un-appropriate words.
  I also think that RIPE NCC's whois database and Routing registory
  very successfully.
  I would like to say separating function.
  Whois database which is managed by IR is registered a administration
  information. In other hand, the routing registry is registered
  a routing information.
  I think that RIPE NCC's database separate these function well.

> 
> >   I think that this point is a big problem.
> >   Information which is managed RR usually duplicate. And, a part of
> >   these information has been not done maintenance. Therefore, these
> >   information can not keep consistency.
> 
> How do you force ISPs to ensure the information is consistent? It's a good 
> question. There is no magic switch we can pull which makes their network 
> stop working due to bad registration information.

  I think so.
  I think that to keep consistency is very difficult.
  At least, I would like to change following issue.
     - when we get one AS information, we get some different information.
	 In this situation, I hope to be solved that AS information is 
         registered for only one RR.
     - obsolete administrative information was registered for RR.
	 In this situation, I hope to be solved that these information is
	 managed by IR.

> 
> >   And, the number of current RR is too many, then when we would like
> >   to collect the informatin of AS as AS Object from IRR, we can not
> >   configure IRR on full mesh mirroring. And then, we cannot get
> >   information enough.
> >   Therefor, I think that for keeping consistency need responsible
> >   organization for coordinating IRR.
> >
> >   In this meaning, I think that IR is the better organization
> >   which is clarified management area and hierarchy of responsibility.
> 
> Sure.... Sounds like a good topic for the Routing SIG at the upcoming APNIC 
> meeting in Brisbane.
> 

  I would like to go Brisbane. Is it in October? 
  Maybe I am not going to go there.

--
Kuniaki Kondo
kuniaki@iij.ad.jp

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